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The Telecom Digest for October 30, 2012
Volume 31 : Issue 252 : "text" Format
Messages in this Issue:
FiOS and battery backups (Bill Horne)
Re: FiOS and battery backups (David Lesher)
Re: FiOS and battery backups (David Lesher)
Re: Feeding Frenzy (HAncock4)
Re: Feeding Frenzy (Bill Horne)
Re: Feeding Frenzy (danny burstein)
The input queue may be slow for a day or two (Telecom Digest Moderator)
Arc Flash (Telecom Digest Moderator)

====== 31 years of TELECOM Digest -- Founded August 21, 1981 ======

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Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 08:37:56 -0400 From: Bill Horne <bill@horneQRM.net> To: telecomdigestmoderator.remove-this@and-this-too.telecom-digest.org. Subject: FiOS and battery backups Message-ID: <k6ltb6$eut$1@dont-email.me> I just received an email entitled "A message to Verizon customers affected by Hurricane Sandy". Since I have a DSL line, the email told me that my service would go out along with the power if the electric feeds go dark. No surprise there, of course, since my DSL modem uses AC, but I wonder if Verizon was warning me that their equipment won't have power, i.e., if there's some intermediate vault that will be out of service without commercial power. The policy used to be that every node was backed up, but I don't know if that has changed. It also warned FiOS customers that their Internet access would be cut off, since the battery back-ups in the FiOS ONT's only provide voice service. I'm wondering why that is so: how much of a "Delta" is there between an ONT that's providing a POTS jack vs. one that's providing Internet and/or TV? Bill -- Bill Horne (Remove QRM from my address to write to me directly)
Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 16:13:35 +0000 (UTC) From: David Lesher <wb8foz@panix.com> To: telecomdigestmoderator.remove-this@and-this-too.telecom-digest.org. Subject: Re: FiOS and battery backups Message-ID: <k6m9vf$99m$1@reader1.panix.com> Bill Horne <bill@horneQRM.net> writes: >but I wonder if Verizon was warning me that their equipment >won't have power, i.e., if there's some intermediate vault that will >be out of service without commercial power. The policy used to be that >every node was backed up, but I don't know if that has changed. More DLCs have a few hours of batteries at best. In theory, Verizontal will dispatch a small generator when needed, but in any big storm: a) They do not have enough generators b) They can't get to the DLC's.` c) The generators get stolen as fast as they are deployed. >It also warned FiOS customers that their Internet access would be cut >off, since the battery back-ups in the FiOS ONT's only provide voice >service. I'm wondering why that is so: how much of a "Delta" is there >between an ONT that's providing a POTS jack vs. one that's providing >Internet and/or TV? Quite a bit; it seems the TV modulators draw more than you'd think. It's easy to test, put an ammeter in series with the battery, and remove the AC line. TV/Internet will shut down in 5 minutes; measure the current before & after they do. But even with just the phone, don't count on that wimpy battery lasting more than a few hours. My recommendation is to get a 75AH deep cycle battery from Wal-Mart & a few feet of #14 wire. - - A host is a host from coast to coast.................wb8foz@nrk.com & no one will talk to a host that's close........[v].(301) 56-LINUX Unless the host (that isn't close).........................pob 1433 is busy, hung or dead....................................20915-1433 ***** Moderator's Note ***** If the DLC's are going to go down anyway, having a 75AH battery on the ONT won't make much difference. Bill Horne Moderator
Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:51:55 +0000 (UTC) From: David Lesher <wb8foz@panix.com> To: telecomdigestmoderator.remove-this@and-this-too.telecom-digest.org. Subject: Re: FiOS and battery backups Message-ID: <k6mtpq$4d2$2@reader1.panix.com> David Lesher <wb8foz@panix.com> writes: >>But even with just the phone, don't count on that wimpy battery >>lasting more than a few hours. My recommendation is to get >>a 75AH deep cycle battery from Wal-Mart & a few feet of #14 wire. >If the DLC's are going to go down anyway, having a 75AH battery >on the ONT won't make much difference. Apples & Oranges FIOS is totally passive outside plant. The only power needed is in the CO, and in your house. The splitters in the beige cabinets are prisms. DLC's support POTS and maybe DSL at non-CO-based multiplexers {to use a term no Bell-head ever would...}. They need power. -- A host is a host from coast to coast.................wb8foz@nrk.com & no one will talk to a host that's close........[v].(301) 56-LINUX Unless the host (that isn't close).........................pob 1433 is busy, hung or dead....................................20915-1433
Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2012 20:23:48 -0700 (PDT) From: HAncock4 <withheld@invalid.telecom-digest.org> To: telecomdigestmoderator.remove-this@and-this-too.telecom-digest.org. Subject: Re: Feeding Frenzy Message-ID: <c4b26247-3120-49eb-8d7a-85a971fa8dd2@o8g2000yqh.googlegroups.com> On Oct 28, 10:48 pm, Bill Horne <b...@horneQRM.net> wrote: > I have my own generator, and enough gasoline to keep it going for a > couple of days, You're fortunate. Unfortunately, for those of us in an apartment it's not a practical option. I've heard of some people investing in a "whole house" generator, a large permanent unit able to power an entire house. They're expensive. But with nasty storms on a regular basis that create extended power failures, they may be justified. > All of this is neither here nor there as far as telecom, but it led me > to wonder if the urge to buy up all the food - or anything else - is > likely to be reflected in the telecom world. Is there a way to measure > sales of cell phones and to see if they've spiked in the last couple > of days? It would be interesting to see the reliability of traditional landline, cell phones, cable, and VOIP telephone services during and after the storm in affected areas. They expect widespread and long lasting power outages, and it will be interesting to see how long cell towers in such areas remain operational (or are overwhelmed by call volume). FWIW, in our area many robo-calls have already been sent out by various agencies already with storm preparation recommendations.
Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 09:17:58 -0400 From: Bill Horne <bill@horneQRM.net> To: telecomdigestmoderator.remove-this@and-this-too.telecom-digest.org. Subject: Re: Feeding Frenzy Message-ID: <20121029131758.GA1715@telecom.csail.mit.edu> On Sun, Oct 28, 2012 at 08:23:48PM -0700, HAncock4 wrote: > On Oct 28, 10:48 pm, Bill Horne <b...@horneQRM.net> wrote: > > > > I have my own generator, and enough gasoline to keep it going for a > > couple of days, > > You're fortunate. Unfortunately, for those of us in an apartment it's > not a practical option. Not necessarily: if you have a fire escape, a small inverter unit would be quiet enough to use. It would have to be outdoors, of course, and I don't know if that includes air wells, but there are units that are quiet enough for apartment buildings that would keep your refrigerator cold. > I've heard of some people investing in a "whole house" generator, a > large permanent unit able to power an entire house. They're > expensive. But with nasty storms on a regular basis that create > extended power failures, they may be justified. I don't have a "whole house" generator; it's a 5,000 watt model that will power my furnace and the refrigerator and a few lights or maybe a stove-top burner, but it's not intended to provide transparent or instantaneous changeover. I have to manually transfer power from the utility line to the generator, after I wheel the genset out of my shed and yank it through the mud and run the special 220v cable out from my transfer switch. "Whole house" units that run from Propane or Natural gas cost a lot more, and I didn't feel the expense was justified. They need a cement pad, gas pipe, buried wires, and regular professional maintenance: it was just too much for my budget. I bought the one I have for $567 after last year's October storm, which left me out for two days and my sister out for six. It was a discontinued model that Home Depot was selling at a discount, so I was able to justify the expense, since I was competent enough to wire the transfer switch and 220 volt cable myself. The problem with nasty storms is that the power company sometimes turns off power as a precaution: they're afraid of getting sued if someone drives over a downed line, not to mention the zillions of TV sets and computers that can be damaged by power surges when wires cross. Some electric utility companies won't endure the risks: a little lost revenue is nothing compared to what a high-powered attorney could get in a contributory negligence tort. That leaves you and me to fend for ourselves, and that means generators. > > All of this is neither here nor there as far as telecom, but it led me > > to wonder if the urge to buy up all the food - or anything else - is > > likely to be reflected in the telecom world. Is there a way to measure > > sales of cell phones and to see if they've spiked in the last couple > > of days? > > It would be interesting to see the reliability of traditional > landline, cell phones, cable, and VOIP telephone services during and > after the storm in affected areas. Do you have any statistics from New Jersey? You're in the path of the storm, so please tell us what the "official" figures are. > They expect widespread and long lasting power outages, and it will be > interesting to see how long cell towers in such areas remain > operational (or are overwhelmed by call volume). Operational, well, that's a thorny issue. Requirements vary from one state to another, and there's always the temptation to "magic pencil" battery checks and genset tests. Call volume, not so much: with businesses closed, the volume won't be an issue. > FWIW, in our area many robo-calls have already been sent out by > various agencies already with storm preparation recommendations. Did the "1-000-000-0000" CID mark the call I got as a "Reverse 911" communication? -- Bill Horne (Remove QRM from my address to write to me directly)
Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 13:36:30 +0000 (UTC) From: danny burstein <dannyb@panix.com> To: telecomdigestmoderator.remove-this@and-this-too.telecom-digest.org. Subject: Re: Feeding Frenzy Message-ID: <k6m0ou$eao$1@reader1.panix.com> In <20121029131758.GA1715@telecom.csail.mit.edu> Bill Horne <bill@horneQRM.net> writes: >> >> > I have my own generator, and enough gasoline to keep it going for a >> > couple of days, >> >> You're fortunate. Unfortunately, for those of us in an apartment it's >> not a practical option. >Not necessarily: if you have a fire escape, a small inverter unit >would be quiet enough to use. Your local fire chief would get very, very, upset if she saw a gasoline powered appliance on your fire escape... -- _____________________________________________________ Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key dannyb@panix.com [to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded]
Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 15:51:21 -0400 From: Telecom Digest Moderator <telecomdigestsubmissions.remove-this@and-this-too.telecom-digest.org> To: telecomdigestmoderator.remove-this@and-this-too.telecom-digest.org. Subject: The input queue may be slow for a day or two Message-ID: <20121029195121.GA18552@telecom.csail.mit.edu> My power just went off, so I'm going to shut down to conserve wear and tear on the generator. The input queue may be slow for a day or two: I hope everyone comes through the storm without injury or damage. Good luck! Bill -- Bill Horne Moderator
Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 19:12:12 -0400 From: Telecom Digest Moderator <redacted@invalid.telecom.csail.mit.edu> To: telecomdigestmoderator.remove-this@and-this-too.telecom-digest.org. Subject: Arc Flash Message-ID: <20121029231212.GA26707@telecom.csail.mit.edu> I've seen the safety films. I've seen the Utube videos. I've seen the demonstrations. Nothing compares to what I saw tonight. Right after I last wrote, I went out to get some more gas, just to have it on hand. On the way home after a trip to the gas station and the supermarket (which was nearly deserted, btw), I was taken aback by a "Detour" sign blocking the road: a tree had fallen across it while I was shopping. I started to make the turn onto the alternate route. The sky lit up like God's own welding torch. It was an hv arc flash, which lasted over thirty seconds. I went down the road, and saw some smoke coming across, but no wires, so I kept going, but when I got up to the smoke I realized that the hv line was lying across someone's lawn, burning the grass. I told the fire department. I'm back on the generator just for long enough that my wife could cook dinner. I'll stop now. Stay safe! Bill -- Bill Horne Moderator
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