TELECOM Digest     Fri, 24 Jun 2005 05:12:00 EDT    Volume 24 : Issue 287

Inside This Issue:                             Editor: Patrick A. Townson

    Cardholders Kept in Dark After Breach (Marcus Didius Falco)
    Ubiquitous Technology, Bad Practices Drive Up Data Theft (Marcus Falco)
    Yahoo Closes All User Defined Chat Rooms (Lisa Minter)
    SBC DSL Total Fee Per Month (jrefactors@hotmail.com)
    Re: ISP Hunting (Choreboy)
    Re: Hayes Smartmodems (was Re: Bell Divestiture) (Lisa Hancock)
    Re: Hayes Smartmodems (was Re: Bell Divestiture) (Tony P.)
    Re: 40 U.S. Senators Offer BiPartisan Data Breach Bill (Thomas Horsley)
    Re: DSL Speed (Lisa Hancock)
    Re: Power Strips for Home Networks (ellis@no.spam)

Telecom and VOIP (Voice over Internet Protocol) Digest for the
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               ===========================

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We must fight spam for the same reason we fight crime: not because we
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we do not want the kind of world that results when no one stands
against crime.   Geoffrey Welsh

               ===========================

See the bottom of this issue for subscription and archive details
and the name of our lawyer; other stuff of interest.  

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2005 00:51:47 -0400
From: Marcus Didius Falco <falco_marcus_didius@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Cardholders Kept in Dark After Breach -- Washington Post


I had been planning to call my active credit card companies to
determine whether any had been compromised. This article caused me to
start the process this morning, calling American Express, my most
active account.

After thanking me for carrying their card for 21 years, they refused
to tell me whether any of my three cards was among those
compromised. They tried to tell me that they have all sorts of
"anti-fraud" procedures. Even so, it was Master Card and not American
Express that first uncovered the problem, and there is no way I can
reliably double check an account that has dozens of charges a month,
many of them posted in the name of parent companies located at head
offices in other cities, so that many of the charges are not easily
verified and must usually be taken on faith.

Accordingly, I told them to cancel all three cards and send me new
ones.  They were not happy, but were unwilling to tell me whether the
cards had been compromised. Perhaps if they have the expense of
replacing many customers credit cards, some necessarily and many
unnnecessarily, they will start taking security and customer service
more seriously.

When I get the new American Express cards I will call the second most
active card in my wallet, and so on down the list.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/06/22/AR2005062202
037.html
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/06/22/AR2005062202
037_pf.html

washingtonpost.com

Cardholders Kept in Dark After Breach

Some Banks Decline to Tell Customers Whether Accounts Were Compromised

By Mike Musgrove

Consumer advocates said credit card customers have been denied crucial
information in the wake of a recent data breach, as some major banks
are declining to tell cardholders whether their account may have been
accessed by hackers.

In a security lapse disclosed by MasterCard International Inc. last
week, 40 million credit card and debit card numbers were exposed to an
intruder who gained access sometime last year through a
credit-processing firm. An interagency group of federal banking
regulators has begun an investigation into the incident.

Meanwhile, Internet security firm Secure Computing Corp. warned
yesterday that a fresh appearance of an old e-mail scam appears to
come from opportunistic fraudsters hoping to use fear about the recent
data theft as a way to trick MasterCard customers into giving up their
account information.

Companies such as J.P. Morgan Chase & Co., Citigroup Inc., American Express
Co. and MBNA Corp. said that they are not automatically alerting their
customers that their information may have been exposed but that they
are more closely monitoring the accounts that may have been
affected. The policy was reported yesterday on CNetNews.com.

Such credit-card-issuing banks said MasterCard and Visa have shared
with them lists of account numbers that may have been
compromised. Though such accounts may earn heightened scrutiny from
the banks that issued them, customers may never know whether their
account numbers were among those stolen by hackers.

"Those accounts have been flagged, and we're watching them even more
closely than we otherwise would," said Jim Donahue, spokesman at
MBNA. "If we start to see an unusual rate of fraud [among the set of
compromised accounts], we would consider notifying those customers
impacted -- but we haven't seen that yet."

MasterCard said yesterday that it is up to banks that issue credit
cards to determine whether to contact cardholders.

Consumer watchdog groups decried such policies as bad for consumers.

"That sounds really bad to us," said Chanelle Hardy, legislative
counsel at Consumers Union, the nonprofit publisher of Consumer
Reports magazine. "Any time that any unauthorized person gets access
to sensitive or personal information, [the cardholder] should be
notified," she said. "For a consumer, it's the first line of
defense. It's almost their only line of defense."

The breach reported last week occurred at a processing center in
Tucson operated by CardSystems Solutions Inc. and may have been the
largest such theft. CardSystems did not return a call for comment
yesterday.

The Federal Financial Institutions Examination Council has issued
guidelines for when a bank should disclose to its customers that
account information may have been stolen.

Michael L. Jackson, chairman of the FFIEC's information technology
subcommittee, said yesterday that it was too early in the
investigation to recommend one course or another.

There has not yet been any fraudulent activity associated with the
stolen credit card numbers, said Sharon Gamsin, vice president of
communications at MasterCard. If bogus charges do show up, customers
often are not held responsible but can spend years clearing their
credit ratings if someone steals their identity.

Within 24 hours of last week's news of the breach, a new version of an
Internet scam was circulating on the Web. In an e-mail forged to look
as if it had come from MasterCard, recipients were urged to log in to
a counterfeited MasterCard site and enter their account information.

That Web site had apparently been taken down yesterday afternoon. It
was registered in the name of Tucson resident Donald Cuppe, whose wife
said in an interview yesterday that the couple knew nothing about the
site but had received a call from their bank on Monday alerting them
that their Visa debit card number was stolen.

Washingtonpost.com staff writer Brian Krebs contributed to this report.

Copyright 2005 The Washington Post Company

NOTE: For more telecom/internet/networking/computer news from the
daily media, check out our feature 'Telecom Digest Extra' each day at
http://telecom-digest.org/td-extra/more-news.html . Hundreds of new
articles daily.

*** FAIR USE NOTICE. This message contains copyrighted material the
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understanding of literary, educational, political, and economic
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to use this copyrighted material for purposes of your own that go
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For more information go to:
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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2005 00:57:46 -0400
From: Marcus Didius Falco <falco_marcus_didius@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: FWD: Ubiquitous Technology, Bad Practices Drive Up Data Theft


The next day the Post reported that many large card issuers have NOT
chosen to notify customers. Indeed, as I report, American Express
refused to inform me when I called them, causing me to have to change
the numbers on my cards.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/06/21/AR2005062101615.html
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/06/21/AR2005062101615_pf.html


washingtonpost.com

Ubiquitous Technology, Bad Practices Drive Up Data Theft

By Jonathan Krim

Call 2005 the year of the data breach.

One day, tapes with the Social Security numbers of 1.2 million federal
workers are reported missing. Another day it's hackers gaining access
to private information on 120,000 alumni at Boston College. Then, last
Friday, comes word that 40 million credit card numbers fell prey to
computer criminals.

Collectively, nearly 50 million accounts have been exposed to the
possibility of identity fraud since the beginning of the year, a
significant increase from last year.

Security experts, law enforcement officials and privacy advocates
agree that while computer crime is on the rise, it is hardly new.

So why the apparent escalation?

In part, organizations are telling their customers or employees about
incidents more than they used to, many complying with a California
notification law that is being considered as the basis of possible
federal legislation.

After data broker ChoicePoint Inc. reported in February that it was
infiltrated by identity thieves posing as legitimate customers, the
company received a second black eye when reports surfaced that it did
not notify consumers about a previous breach, before California's law
took effect.  Now, most organizations are choosing to notify potential
victims.

Experts see other factors contributing to the data-theft siege.

A boom in data collection has created a marketplace of valuable information
stored on computers in thousands of places, many with weak security.

"The current fiascos in cyber-security have been occurring for the
past 10 years," said Tom Kellermann, who recently left his position as
senior data risk management specialist for the World Bank.

Kellermann and others blame poorly designed software, inattention to
data security and an underappreciation of the problem by top
management in corporations and other institutions.

"We've used weak practices for some time," said Chuck Wade, an
Internet security and commerce consultant. "The vulnerabilities are
well known, and we have not been improving the security measures
 ... as we should have been."

At the same time, some hackers who used to get their kicks merely
being disruptive are pooling efforts with organized criminals, said
Jonathan J.  Rusch, a special counsel in the fraud section of the
Justice Department.

"The motivation now is money," Rusch said. In addition to using stolen
data for credit card or other financial fraud, a thriving black market
for the stolen data itself exists online, run in large part from
Eastern Europe.

Among the most extreme examples of data for sale are offerings known
in the online underground as "fulls." These reports include not only
Social Security and credit card numbers, but also account passwords
for Web sites that a consumer might use, such as eBay or a bank.

"There's so much information that has been leaked out over the years,
it may be that there are, outside of the country, criminal elements
with huge databases on American consumers," Wade said.

With more and more people getting high-speed Internet connections, and
participating in online commerce and banking, the targets of
opportunity for criminals only grow.

Wade and others argue that many industry players have not responded
aggressively enough because they are insulated from the financial
consequences of breaches.

Banks and credit card companies, for example, pay nothing when a
criminal uses someone's credit card for a fraudulent charge. The same
is true for credit card processing companies such as CardSystems
Solutions Inc., which announced last week that it housed the 40
million credit card numbers that hackers may have obtained.

Payment processors and banks collect fees for charges that are reversed.

"They are making money on fraudulent transactions," said Brian
Mortensen, head of a New Jersey company that sells telecommunications
equipment. "They should not be allowed to do that."

Mortensen said that as a result of fraudulent purchases, his firm has
lost $12,000 to $15,000 on equipment that will never be recovered and
owes several thousand dollars more in various fees.

Although consumers generally don't have to pay for fraudulent charges
on their credit cards, if their identity has been compromised it can
take years and thousands of dollars to restore good credit.

Some security experts say many financial companies have been slow to
adopt multiple layers of customer verification, such as requiring a
password and a second identification number. Many companies also are
not encrypting stored data.

But many firms argue that while data protection is a top priority,
such measures could make online commerce too inconvenient for
consumers without adding appreciably to security. And security already
is a large business expense.

Companies must monitor their computer networks and "patch" vulnerabilities
in software that are discovered regularly.

That can be especially complex when firms merge and one company's
system needs to be incorporated into another's, said David Thomas,
head of the FBI's computer intrusion section.

"It's very, very difficult to stay on top of it," Thomas said.

Moreover, said Mark Rasch, a former federal prosecutor who works for
an Internet security firm, "The company has to try to protect against
every kind of attack. The intruder only needs to find one."

Some breaches, such as mortgage data from General Motors Acceptance
Corp.  that was stored on a laptop stolen from a car, leave consumers
wondering how seriously companies take information security.

Sen. Dianne Feinstein (D-Calif.), one of several on Capitol Hill
sponsoring identity theft legislation, said the CardSystems incident
last week "is a clear sign that industry's efforts to self-regulate
when it comes to protecting consumers' sensitive personal data are
failing."

Thomas F. Holt Jr., an attorney who represents companies involved in
breach cases, said he expects things to change when large class-action
suits begin to get filed against firms for improperly protecting
information.

"When that game is afoot ... companies will begin to redouble their
security efforts and reexamine a lot of assumptions they have regarding the
gathering and storing of sensitive data," Holt said.


Copyright 2005 The Washington Post Company

NOTE: For more telecom/internet/networking/computer news from the
daily media, check out our feature 'Telecom Digest Extra' each day at
http://telecom-digest.org/td-extra/more-news.html . Hundreds of new
articles daily.

*** FAIR USE NOTICE. This message contains copyrighted material the
use of which has not been specifically authorized by the copyright
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receiving the included information in their efforts to advance the
understanding of literary, educational, political, and economic
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believe that this constitutes a 'fair use' of the copyrighted material
as provided for in section 107 of the U.S.  Copyright Law. If you wish
to use this copyrighted material for purposes of your own that go
beyond 'fair use,' you must obtain permission from the copyright
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For more information go to:
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/17/107.shtml

------------------------------

From: Lisa Minter <lisa_minter2001@yahoo.com>
Subject: Yahoo Shuts Down Chat Rooms Amid Child Sex Concerns
Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 14:11:38 -0500


By Duncan Martell

Yahoo Inc. the most-used Internet site, has shut down all its
user-created Internet chat rooms amid concerns that adults were using
the sites to try to have sex with minors.

The giant Internet media company closed down those chat rooms and the
ability to create new ones "in the past week," said Yahoo spokeswoman
Mary Osako.

Chat rooms created and sponsored by Yahoo itself remain open, Osako
said.  The number of user-created chat rooms is variable at any given
time and Yahoo does not track that figure, she said.

The user-created chat rooms in question, where Internet users converse
in real time, had names including "Girls 13 And Under For Older Guys"
and "Girls 13 And Up For Much Older Men" and were all listed under
"education chat rooms," Houston television station KPRC reported.

"We are working on improvements to the service to enhance users'
experience and their compliance with our terms of service," Osako
said. "Yahoo condemns the use of Internet tools for illegal
activities."

KPRC reported last month that major advertisers including PepsiCo
Inc., Georgia-Pacific Corp. and State Farm Mutual Automobile Insurance
Co. removed their ads after the station found the ads were appearing
on Yahoo user-created chat rooms that were aimed at sex with children.

"As soon as we found out we pulled our ads," said Pepsi spokesman Dave
DeCecco. "We were totally unaware our ads were associated with those
chat rooms -- and that was back in April."

Pepsi continues to advertise on other parts of Yahoo's site, mostly in
sports and music sections, but pulled all its ads in user-created chat
rooms.

"They were down the same day we found out about it," DeCecco said,
referring to the ads on user chat rooms.

"We were horrified to find out we were on those sites," said
Georgia-Pacific spokeswoman Robin Keegan, who said that the company
still advertises on other parts of Yahoo. "As soon as we found out,
that day we pulled that advertising."

A spokesperson for State Farm was not immediately available to
comment.

The concern over online safety for children using the Internet has
surged with the number of people using the Internet, which allows for
anonymous and sometimes hard-to-trace communication and content.

It's also not the first time that Yahoo has faced the issue of users
taking advantage of its free services to lure young children.

A minor and his parents in May filed a $10 million lawsuit against
Yahoo and a man who once operated a Yahoo Groups site where members
traded child pornography.

Many attorneys argue that the Communications Decency Act shields Web
sites from responsibility for material posted by users.

But the lawsuit, filed on May 9 in U.S. District Court for the Eastern
District of Texas, charged that Yahoo breached its duties by allowing
co-defendant Mark Bates and others to share child pornography on a
site, called Candyman, that Mister Bates created and moderated via the
Yahoo Groups service.

A child pornography investigation led by the U.S. Federal Bureau of
Investigation and dubbed Operation Candyman targeted Yahoo Groups
users and ultimately resulted in the arrest of more than 100 people in
the United States.


Copyright 2005 Reuters Limited.

------------------------------

From: jrefactors@hotmail.com
Subject: SBC DSL Total Fee Per Month
Date: 23 Jun 2005 21:30:22 -0700


I haven't subscribed SBC DSL before. I am interested in the Express
package that charges 14.95 per month, but it excludes tax and FUSF
fee. I want to ask usually how much it will charge for each month in
my case?

Please advise. Thanks!!


[TELECOM Digest Editor's Note:  I don't think they themselves know
exactly how much it will cost from one month to the next. When I used
to allow SBC here in my home two or three years ago, for local phone
service _and_ DSL, the total bill each month was never less than one
hundred dollars per month, and I was allegedly eligible for discounts
given to senior citizens and disabled people under their 'lifeline'
program. Even though SBC was instructed by the Kansas commmissioners
to apply those rates to me, SBC retaliated with a phone bill which 
was _26 pages_ long full of all sorts of 'partial month credits' and
'rerates' for things, and the end result was the bill was eighteen
dollars more than the month before! They lie about their prices and
plans. For example, they told me _three years ago_ that I could have
that $14.95 per month rate on DSL 'as long as you have Cingular cell
phone service as well ...'  I've had Cingular for a long time, but 
then SBC decided I as not eligible. They were also charging me for
'anonymous call blocking' but then not blocking anonymous calls, and
their chairman's office claimed that if a caller passed a string of
'zeros' or 'ones' as their caller ID, that was sufficient and did
not qualify for blocking purposes. I'd be very cautious about
accepting their word on any of their plans; they find so many ways
to make promises and then not keep them. You'd be better off going
with a more reputable company, or perhaps cable internet.   PAT]

------------------------------

From: Choreboy <choreboyREMOVE@localnet.com>
Subject: Re: ISP Hunting
Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 15:08:03 -0400
Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com



DevilsPGD wrote:

> In message <telecom24.278.7@telecom-digest.org> Choreboy
> <choreboyREMOVE@localnet.com> wrote:

>> Don't you want news-server access?  That's the most common
>> deal-breaker for me.

> Nope.  No web hosting, no email, no usenet, no technical support,
> hell, they don't even need a tollfree customer service number.

> DNS is about the only thing I'd use (other then IP transit) but it's
> not mandatory, I run my own DNS servers anyway (and most of the stuff
> I'll be accessing will be through my VPN and in-house proxies anyway)

> Once the VPN is up I can access literally everything I need right
> through there.  Just PPTP at the moment, although if I have the time
> to get IPSec working, I might switch over.

>> Budget ISPs often contract with dialup providers.  The quality of
>> service can depend on this, and the ISP's representative may not be in
>> a position to know what's wrong.

> True enough.

>> At $9.95 I've been with localnet a couple of years, I guess.  At times
>> I've looked for alternatives, but in the long run things have worked
>> out.

> I'll check 'em out, thanks!  Any idea what they're like for short-term
> access?

They charge $12 setup, so the first month would be $21.95, if that's
what you mean.

There were no problems for my first several months.  Sometimes
episodes of repeated annoyances have made me think of switching, but
they got fixed.  That's what I mean by "the long run."

As someone pointed out, freedomlist.com has lots of cheap ISPs, and
some are probably very good.  They say localnet is too expensive.  I
tried access4less based on recommendations there.  As it turned out,
their service had recently gone bad.  It was terrible in many ways:
the signup, download speeds, and customer service.  A few days after I
signed up, they dropped dialup.  I was glad I hadn't dropped localnet.

------------------------------

From: hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com
Subject: Re: Hayes Smartmodems (was Re: Bell Divestiture)
Date: 23 Jun 2005 13:29:19 -0700


Fred Atkinson wrote:

> I got him to describe the setup.  Then I asked him how he was making
> it dial.  He told me that he was typing in 'ATD9,' and then the area
> code and the number.

> When Hayes designed the Smartmodem, they should have had the unit
> default to touch-tone instead of outpulsing rotor dialing by default.
> Incidents like this could have been avoided.  I happened to know that
> this customer's PBX did not support rotary dialing.  The 'T' I added
> to the string switched the unit from default rotary dialing to touch
> tone.  Problem solved.

I'm confused.  IIRC, the command was four characters, either
ATDT or ATDP.  Are you saying it would work with three?

Also, for dialing out of a PBX, wasn't a 'pause' character needed to
allow time for the second dial tone?

Way back then a lot of people still had rotary service and most
systems supported both.  I don't think early on defaulting to pulse
was such a bad idea for those days.

IIRC, Hayes was the leader in modems, but didn't they end up going
bankrupt?  I didn't understand that.

> [TELECOM Digest Editor's Note: I think we used 'ATT' for tone dialing
> and 'ATP' for pulse dialing. Fred, (in a help desk capacity) did you
> ever run across customers who _lied_, told you they had tried to do
> something but in fact had not done it at all.

That certainly does happen.  But more commonly is people who _think_
they did something when they actually didn't, or for some reason what
they entered didn't take (ie keyboard locked up and they didn't
realize it -- that's very common.)

------------------------------

From: Tony P. <kd1s@nospamplease.cox.reallynospam.net>
Subject: Re: Hayes Smartmodems (was Re: Bell Divestiture) 
Organization: ATCC
Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 17:23:48 -0400


In article <telecom24.286.3@telecom-digest.org>, TELECOM Digest Editor
noted in response to fatkinson@mishmash.com: 

>> [TELECOM Digest Editor's Note: I had a couple of Hayes Modems which
>> could be switched between pulse and tone dialing, and you could set
>> the 'speed' of the pulsing or the 'speed' of the tone signals. You
>> could make both modes go quite fast; with tone dialing so fast that
>> it was little more than just a single blip in your ear, and most
>> times it would work quite well. Only on occassion the modem would
>> give its short little blip or tone burst when dialing *before* the
>> line was set up to allow it, and you would have to redial, but
>> usually it worked okay.  PAT]

> I had a Hayes 300 modem when 1200 baud was considered astronomically
> fast.  I kept it until I upgraded to a Hayes 2400 baud modem.  I think
> both of them are still in one of my goody boxes put away, for all the
> good they'll be to me now.

> I had become very familar with the Smartmodem when it first came out.
> I was working for MCI at the time.  One day, we got a phone call from
> a salesman who was at one of our customer sites.  This customer had
> several MCI long distance lines hooked up to his PBX.  The salesman
> had sold them a Smartmodem 1200 but was unable to make it work through
> the PBX.  When the customer mentioned the MCI lines, the salesman
> pointed the finger at MCI.

> So the customer called and put the salesman on the phone with one of
> our people.  That person just happened to know I knew a lot about the
> Smartmodem and transfered the salesman to me.

> I got him to describe the setup.  Then I asked him how he was making
> it dial.  He told me that he was typing in 'ATD9,' and then the area
> code and the number.

> I knew immediately what was wrong when he said that.  I told him to
> try typing in 'ATDT9,' and the area code and the number.  He took this
> attitude that how could a telephone technician know anything about a
> Smartmodem.

> I asked him what he had to lose by trying it.  So, finally, he did.

> I heard him typing, then I heard the dial tone from the Smartmodem,
> then I heard it outpulse digit 9 in DTMF.  I then heard secondary
> dialtone and then the area code and number outpulsed in DTMF.

> Then, I heard the distant modem answer, the local modem respond in
> carrier, and then the speaker went silent.

> I then heard the salesman shout, 'IT WORKS'.  Then he came back to the
> telephone.  His voice was showing that he was very embarrassed.

> I knew I was going to laugh out loud, so I needed to get off the phone
> quickly.  I told him I was glad to help him and that he should call me
> back if he ever needed more help.  Thank you and goodbye, so to speak.
> I laughed hysterically for several minutes after I got off the phone.

> The boss was very grateful.  This was a customer we wanted to keep a
> very good relationship with.  He thanked me very much.

> When Hayes designed the Smartmodem, they should have had the unit
> default to touch-tone instead of outpulsing rotor dialing by default.
> Incidents like this could have been avoided.  I happened to know that
> this customer's PBX did not support rotary dialing.  The 'T' I added
> to the string switched the unit from default rotary dialing to touch
> tone.  Problem solved.

> Regards,

> Fred Atkinson

> [TELECOM Digest Editor's Note: I think we used 'ATT' for tone dialing
> and 'ATP' for pulse dialing. 

Actually it was ATD and ATDT if you wanted to be fussy. AT was the 
attention grabber, followed by the command and then any parameters. 

If I recall correctly you could set one of the S registers to a value
to default DTMF dialing on ATD.

------------------------------

Subject: Re: 40 U.S. Senators Offer BiPartisan Data Breach Bill
From: tom.horsley@att.net (Thomas A. Horsley)
Organization: AT&T Worldnet
Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 22:49:12 GMT


> Businesses and consumers have urged the Republican-controlled Congress
> to pass a national version of the California notification law.

But notification is the least of the problems. Most companies won't
even know they've been hacked (the most recent problem only showed up
when they started working backwards from bogus charges noticed by
consumers).

What is needed is enforcement of better standards for protecting the
data in the first place.

>>==>> The *Best* political site <URL:http://www.vote-smart.org/> >>==+
      email: Tom.Horsley@worldnet.att.net icbm: Delray Beach, FL      |
<URL:http://home.att.net/~Tom.Horsley> Free Software and Politics <<==+

------------------------------

From: hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com
Subject: Re: DSL Speed
Date: 23 Jun 2005 13:54:16 -0700


Choreboy wrote:

> Couldn't technology analogous to a megaphone be applied to dialup as
> well as DSL?

Yes.

> Ah, crosstalk!  It seems to me that if DSL uses the same wire dialup
> used, the same crosstalk will be present.

Not necessarily.  Remember AM and FM radio waves go through the same
air, but AM is much more sensitive to lightning and other static than
is FM.

DSL service may be arrangeed to minimize crosstalk.

> On dialup, it seemed to be the wire that wouldn't let me connect at
> the farm at the same speed I could connect a block from the CO.  I
> wonder how the farm wire, that wouldn't take 50k on dialup, will carry
> 1.5M or more on DSL.

Because it's NOT just the wire to the farm, but ALSO other parts of
the telephone plant being set up for DSL.

> I have trouble understanding on the phone, and I often resort to the
> phonetic alphabet to be understood.  I think the problem may be more
> in the typical quality of phones than in bandwidth.

You could have broadcast quality microphones and loudspeakers and it
will still sound like a telephone because of the limited bandwidth.
Since bandwidth is limited, telephone components aren't high fidelity
as it would be a waste to make them so.  (I believe the modern "K"
handset is clearer than the older "G" handset.)

> Does a POTS line from the CO to a house carry multiple voices?

Depending on the location, often times yes.  Between central offices
or within the CO almost always yes.  I mean if you live across the
street from the CO you probably have dedicated copper pair, but you
live some distance you probably are multiplexed over a carrier line.
The degree of multiplex determines your bandwidth.

> A bundle can be cheaper if you would have bought all the services
> anyway.

What matters is the total price.  When I got a car it came bundled
with power windows, which I didn't want.  Multiple dealers told me I'd
pay _more_ to go a la carte and not have the power windows because it
was a special order to them.  So I got the power windows.  (Turned out
I like them.  Sure, I could've hunted for a dealer who'd give me a
better deal, but at some point the cost of the hunt would've exceeded
any benefit).

> For marketing, bundling can entice a customer who would not
> otherwise have bought them all.  You lose the customer who wnats just
> one and doesn't have money to waste.  That's why Henry Ford didn't
> bundle his cars with garages.

Remember that while Henry Ford did very well at first, eventually
General Motors and Chrysler surpassed him with their cars.  They
couldn't be the Model T on price, but they had better marketing.  What
was great in 1918 wasn't so great in 1928.  Henry Ford was so stubborn
he almost ruined the company and his family had to take it away from
him.  Even his wife voted her shares with the others and he was forced
out.  It's a shame such a brilliant man was also such an mean SOB.
His "$5/day" wages was partly myth.

> I was speaking of Bellsouth's costs.  I understood million-dollar
> switches were the big cost for voice service, while equipment to carry
> heavy internet traffic was the big cost for DSL.

In many cases, if not all, the equipment is the same.  Today voice
talk is converted to digital for transmission, and those digital
signals share the lines with DSL signals.  I'd say the biggest
investment (beyond more capacity) was in local loops so that customers
could have reasonable speed on DSL.  Not everyone can get it.

> Is a 14.4 modem more lightning proof than a 56k?

No, they're just easy to find laying around idle so one may take them
and others will be glad you removed some old clutter.

------------------------------

From: ellis@no.spam 
Subject: Re: Power Strips for Home Networks
Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 21:24:45 -0000
Organization: S.P.C.A.A.


In article <telecom24.282.8@telecom-digest.org>, TELECOM Digest Editor
noted in response to <ellis@no.spam>:

> [TELECOM Digest Editor's Note: I think the problem would arise when
> the circuit breaker goes out of order, for example, melted into place
> where it should not be.

But chaining strips would increase the chances of a breaker tripping
since there would be more of them.

------------------------------


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